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Approved Oct 10, 2007 - Aviation Advisory Minutes


Aviation Advisory Committee
October 10, 2007
Milton, Florida

The Aviation Advisory Committee met on the above date with the following members present: Chairman Carlos Diaz, and members Marty Martin and Clay McCutchan. Also present were the County Administrator (Hunter Walker), County Engineer (Roger Blaylock), and Administrative Services Manager (Tammy Simmons). Chairman Diaz called the meeting to order at 5:10p.m. Vice-Chairman Randel Compton arrived late.

Diaz said there is no quorum; therefore, this is an informational meeting only.

There was discussion on committee members notifying staff when they are unable to attend a scheduled meeting.

Chairman Issues

Diaz asked if the new hangar lease policy can be sent to the Board of County Commissioners prior to approval by the Aviation Advisory Committee. Walker said staff prefer to tell the Board of County Commissioners that hangar lease policy changes have been reviewed by the Aviation AdvisoryCommittee. He said he is trying to getthe policy on the Board of County Commissioners’ agenda in October because of meetings being cancelled for holidays in November and December. There was discussion on emailing the new hangar lease policy to all Aviation Advisory Committee members for a response. Walker said this is not a good idea because of Florida Sunshine Laws requiring open meetings. Diaz asked if an unofficial vote can be sent to the Board of County Commissioners regarding the new hangar lease policy. The new proposed hangar lease policy was distributed to committee members. (Attachment in file) Walker said there have been changes to the proposed hangar lease policy since the last meeting. He said section 1C addressing air worthiness of aircraft is one sectionthat was changed. Simmons said Tom Dannheisser, County Attorney, said there may be places in the language of section 1C that can use “and/or” instead of just “and.” There was discussion on what documentation is needed to prove airworthiness in order to rent a hangar. Blaylock asked if experimental aircraft have certification documents. Diaz said experimental aircraft
require certification, but the Aviation Advisory Committee never decided the length of time to give experimental aircraft to become air worthy. There was discussion on 1 year being long enough to get an experimental aircraft air worthy. Diaz said he felt 1 year is a reasonable amount of time to get an experimental aircraft air worthy with a current annual inspection as long as the lease states an extension can be given for extenuating circumstances. He discussed reasons for annual inspections and possible delays. Diaz said he felt an airworthiness certificate and a registration certificate are not needed to prove an aircraft is air worthy. Simmons asked if an experimental aircraft has an airworthiness certificate if it is not built yet. Diaz said no, but the owner is being given 1 year to get the aircraft built and certified. He said the airworthiness certificate can be left in as a requirement if staff wants it in the policy. Simmons asked how the committee felt about the “and/or” language being used in section 1C of the policy as suggested by Dannheisser. There was more discussion on documentation aircraft owners will be required to submit to County staff to rent a hangar. Diaz said section 1C can be split up into documentation needed to rent hangars for flyable aircraft and for experimental
aircraft being built. It was decided section 1C is going to be split into the two classifications for requirements of airworthiness documentation.

McCutchan said he was at Peter Prince Airport this weekend and there are several derelict aircraft on the property that have been there for some time. There was discussion on derelict aircraft located on the property. Diaz suggested a letter be sent to the aircraft owners giving them 30 days to remove the derelict aircraft. McCutchan said the derelict aircraft need to be removed from the airport through legal channels. Diaz asked staff to request Dannheisser draft a letter to inform derelict aircraft owners that they have 30 days to remove derelict aircraft.

McCutchan asked if aircraft can be tied down between hangars. Simmons said no. She said when an aircraft is tied down between hangars, the owner is contacted and told to remove the aircraft immediately. Simmons said aircraft being tied down between hangars is an ongoing problem. Diaz said there are not any aircraft being tied down between hangars long term.

McCutchan discussed his recommendation of the language that should be used in section 1A of the hangar policy. There was discussion on “flyable aircraft” and “non-flyable aircraft” in section 1 of the proposed new hangar policy.

Compton arrived making for a quorum. Diaz called the Aviation Advisory Committee meeting to order at 5:20 p.m.

McCutchan moved approval of the minutes from the September 19, 2007 meeting; Martin seconded, and the vote carried unanimously. (4-0)

The Aviation Advisory Committee agreed to modify section 1A of the proposed hangar lease policy to read “Hangars are for the storage of flyable aircraft except as provided in section 1C. Failure to utilize for storage of flyable aircraft shall result in termination of this lease.”

Diaz pointed out the removal of the timeframe regarding evictions in section 3C by Dannheisser.

McCutchan moved approval of the amended hangar lease policy; Martin seconded, and the vote carried unanimously. (4-0)

Martin asked if a motion is needed on removal of derelict aircraft at Peter Prince Airport. Diaz said that issue can be handled by staff. Simmons agreed.

McCutchan asked the status of commercial hangars. Simmons said there are two empty commercial hangars, and the third hangar is going to be empty by the end of November.
McCutchan said the Aviation Advisory Committee previously talked about possibly renting commercial hangars to non-commercial groups or individuals. Diaz said the committee made no definitive decisions on renting commercial hangars to individuals or groups of individuals. There was discussion on what was decided concerning who and at what cost the commercial hangars can be leased. Blaylock said it is his understanding the County is going to try to develop an RFP (Request For Proposal) for commercialhangars. He said this will allow someone to submit their proposal with consideration of priority points given to those currently renting a regular hangar. Blaylock said the idea is to offer the commercial hangars to people currently renting regular hangars first, and then the hangars being vacated by those people relocating into the commercial hangars can be rented to people on the hangar waiting list. Diaz discussed the cost of renting regular hangars versus commercial hangars and the number of people it will take to make it feasible to rent the commercial hangars. Blaylock said staff will evaluate proposals submitted for the RFP and determine if they are feasible. There was discussion on rates, vacancies, interested parties, and the number of aircraft that can be stored in commercial hangars. Compton asked what happens if a tenant in one of the shared commercial hangars damages another tenant’s aircraft. McCutchan said this can be addressed between the individuals renting the shared space. Diaz asked if the individuals renting a commercial hangar can be evicted at any time if a corporation needs the commercial hangar. McCutchan said yes. He said the individuals renting a commercial hangar are going to be aware of this possibility before they lease the commercial hangar. Martin
asked if the individuals renting commercial hangars are going to be able to remain on the regular hangar waiting list just in case they are evicted from the commercial hangar. All
committee members agreed individuals should remain on the regular hangar waiting list while renting a commercial hangar. Simmons said individuals remaining on the regular
hangar waiting list is a current practice. She said all individual tenants renting commercial hangars paythe full price and know ahead of time that if a corporation needs the hangar they will be required to vacate the commercial hangar. Walker asked the amount that should be charged per individual in a commercial hangar. There was discussion on charging individuals the regular T-hangar rate for each aircraft they store in a commercial hangar with a group. McCutchan said individuals sharing a commercial hangar are going to have to form their own agreement on issues related to responsibilities of sharing one commercial hangar. Diaz said he felt there is no liability to the County since an individual understands the risk when leasing a commercial hangar with other individuals. Simmons said Dannheisser can develop a document for leasing commercial hangars to groups of individuals. Simmons asked if the cost proposed is per airplane. Diaz said yes.

McCutchan moved for the County Attorney to draw up policy language for individuals or groups of individuals to lease commercial hangars at Peter Prince Airport when not being leased by corporations and for the language to be brought back to the Aviation Advisory Committee before forwarding to the Board of County Commissioners for approval; Compton seconded, and the vote carried unanimously. (4-0)

Pensacola Flight Watch, Inc. Issues

Dale Holbert said runway 1735 at Pensacola Regional Airport should be reopened in late October. He said the PAPI (Precision Approach Path Indicator) lights on the runway should also be opened by late October. Holbert said the Flight Watch Safety Committee along with the FAA (Federal Aviation Administration) Safety Team Lead Area Representative is currently working on a project to add safety information to the Pensacola Airport’s basic information. He said he will submit a copy to the Aviation Advisory Committee once the information is fully implemented and published.

Holbert said the Aviation Discovery Park is looking good and the covered platform should be installed at the end of the month. He said the picnic tables along with umbrellas should also be installed by the end of the month. Holbert said the individual donating radios stated he is going to install the radios when the weather cools off.

Holbert said he is not aware of any safety issues at Peter Prince Airport. He said the gate is working.

FBO (Fixed Base Operator) Issues

Davis Glass said the only issue at Peter Prince Airport is there have been a number of deer sightings at the airport within the last two weeks. He said the deer seem to ignore aircraft on taxiways. Diaz asked if anything has been done in the past about deer at the airport. There was talk about ongoing deer eradication at the airport. Glass said last week there were some night flights that had to make two approaches to scare the deer off the runway. Walker said there may be a possible hole in the fence at the airport where deer are getting through onto the property.

Other Business

Diaz said a resignation letter was received from Jimmy Beavers. He said the Aviation Advisory Committee wants to thank him for his service on the committee. Walker said the Board of County Commissioners will present Beavers with a letter of appreciation. He said he will let the Aviation Advisory Committee know when the letter of appreciation is going to be resented. Walker asked if another military representative is going to be serving on the Aviation Advisory Committee when Martin retires. Martin said yes. He said he will bring the new individual to the Aviation Advisory Committee meeting after the individual is hired. Walker said Martin is a good candidate for appointment to the Aviation Advisory Committee once he retires. He said Bryon Woram stated he may not be able to continue serving on the Aviation Advisory Committee. There was discussion on the number of Aviation Advisory Committee members that need replacements. Diaz said members may need to be appointed for a 1 or 2 year period with the option ofreappointment if the individual wishes to continue serving. Walker said staff
can work on appointment issues.

McCutchan asked about the CAP (Civil Air Patrol) building at Peter Prince Airport. Simmons said she has been in contact with someone concerning the CAP building, and the person was supposed to send a letter to the Board of County Commissioners concerning the building. She said she does not believe a letter was ever received. Simmons said she left messages for someone to contact her but has not received a response. Martin said the CAP contact person has moved to another office. He said he can get the individual to contact Simmons. Diaz asked if CAP still has a lease for the building. Simmons said yes, but she is trying to find out what CAP’s intentions are for the building so County staff can determine if the building can be demolished. McCutchan said the building looks terrible. Diaz said CAP is very active flying at the airport. Simmons said staff thought CAP was going to repair the building, but it has not been done.

Martin said every year at Whiting Field there is a Naval Helicopter Association Fly In. He said there is going to be a lot of helicopters in the area from October 23 rd through the 27 th . Martin said the helicopters are possibly going to be using 4 fields in the area (Spencer, Santa Rosa, Choctaw, and Harold).

Martin said he needs information on how to contact banner tow companies because there are Alabama tow companies going through fixed wing air patterns. He said he needs to contact the Alabama tow companies before someone gets hurt. There was discussion on who Martin may be able to contact to resolve this problem.

McCutchan asked Martin when he is retiring. Martin said in mid January 2008. McCutchan asked Martin if he is considering serving on the Aviation Advisory Board as a civilian. Martin said he wants to travelfirst.


Walker said the next meeting is scheduled for November 21, 2007. He said this is the day before Thanksgiving. There was discussion on an alternate November date for the next Aviation Advisory Committee meeting.

The next scheduled meeting of the Aviation Advisory Committee is tentativelyscheduled for Wednesday, November 28, 2007 at 5:00 p.m.

There being no further business to come before the Aviation Advisory Committee at this time, the meeting adjourned at 5:54p.m.